ntpclient names

Mark Atwood fallenpegasus at gmail.com
Tue Feb 21 22:20:57 UTC 2017

> What's the actual problem with including ntpviz in the standard install

Anything that triggers a surprise dependency to load libx, a font renderer,
or a font pack onto a ssh & text console -only host gets a veto from me.


On Tue, Feb 21, 2017 at 2:14 PM Eric S. Raymond <esr at thyrsus.com> wrote:

> Hal Murray <hmurray at megapathdsl.net>:
> > As long as they don't get installed, I don't think the ntp prefix is
> > important.
> Nevertheless, I think we should maintain namespace discipline even for
> the uninstalled stuff. It's not always easy to predict what will *remain*
> uninstalled.
> >A hyphen after the ntp might make them easier to read.
> But harder to remember when you're typing.  I actually thought about
> this pretty carefully before squeezing hyphens out of the program
> names at the time of the fork.  I didn't do that casually.
> The problem is that there's no generative rule for where to hyphenate
> in names like these that is both intuitively correct and simple to
> apply on the fly. So if you use hyphens you're implicitly putting on
> users the cognitive burden of remembering semi-arbitrary locations.
> To illustrate the problem, consider the different ways ntpkeygen might
> be hyphenated:
> ntpkeygen
> ntp-key-gen
> ntp-keygen
> ntpkey-gen
> Generally when you hyphenate a compound like that, you're expressing a
> judgment about which subset of parts are tightly bound to each other
> (and should be wordlike) vs. which subparts are more loosely coupled
> and deserve an intermediating hyphen.  It's *hard* to form a simple
> generative rule for this, and harder to apply it consistently across
> multiple names.  You get into fuzzy issues about what the semantic
> units are; effectively you have to commit to preferring one of
> multiple competing phrase parsings for the expansion of the name.
> So I just said "screw it" and ripped all the hyphens out.  Simplest thing,
> and I think we should stick to it.
> > We need to figure out how to handle ntpviz and friends.  I think it
> should
> > NOT be part of the standard install set.  At a minimum, there should be
> an
> > easy way to skip it during install.
> I've forgotten.  What's the actual problem with including ntpviz in
> the standard install?
> --
>                 <a href="http://www.catb.org/~esr/">Eric S. Raymond</a>
> Please consider contributing to my Patreon page at
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