Test farm news

Gary E. Miller gem at rellim.com
Tue Jun 14 21:46:23 UTC 2016

Yo Eric!

On Tue, 14 Jun 2016 17:36:27 -0400
"Eric S. Raymond" <esr at thyrsus.com> wrote:

> Gary E. Miller <gem at rellim.com>:
> > > That's good enough that we can *and should* ignore all the
> > > technical complexities of fudging and log interpretation. We are
> > > *not addressing time nuts* here.  We could do half an order of
> > > magnitude worse than this and still be good enough for a beginner
> > > audience - in fact we'd still be good enough to drive production
> > > WAN time service to RFC 5905 expectations or better.  
> > 
> > Not without PPS and only NMEA, unless the NMEA offset is right.  
> The premise for this HOWTO is exactly that me have 1PPS most of the
> time.  Othwise there's no point in trying to build a Stratum 1 out of
> these parts at all.

Agreed.  No issue there.  But ntpd as it stands now can still misundertand
good PPS when faced with marginal NMEA and lead to bad results.

> > And sometimes even with PPS.  I have seen ntpd stop using the PPS
> > and follow the NMEA off into the weeds.  
> Bug.  Needs fixing.

Yup.  Exactly my point.

> > Not just me.  chronyd market share keeps growing because people
> > keep recommending it over ntpd's.  Convergence is a huge deal on 
> > a laptop.  
> Fair enough, but *not now*, dammit!  The challenge of the HOWTO is to
> ship something simple and basic that will help newbies get a foothold
> in the problem domain.

I'm with you there, I just fail to see why turning on logging is in
conflict with that?

> And chronyd doesn't bother me.

We'll have to agree to disagree on that one.  And we can learn from what
they do right.

> > You need to step back and think of this as more than just an NTP
> > chimer.  This is critical drones and other embedded devices.  
> Later, man, *later*. (Not much later. Couple months, maybe less.)

Fine, and if you start logging now, you'll have the data you need then.

> Right now you're letting the perfect be the enemy of the good.

No, I'm just do not want us to stick our heads in the sand, saying
'la-la-la' because logging is not on.

> > Then humor me.  Can you just try to look at the logs for once?  How
> > do you know it is not valuable when you refuse to look?  
> I'm sure it *is* valuable and I'm not refusing to look, I'm *refusing
> to inflict that level of detail on newbies*.

Tuning on logging is a done deal, just make it the default.

>  As soon as I have some
> clue how to make the visualization tools work, I'll look, I promise.

So, you got your logging on now?  Otherwise you have missed my point.

Gary E. Miller Rellim 109 NW Wilmington Ave., Suite E, Bend, OR 97703
	gem at rellim.com  Tel:+1 541 382 8588
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